Valve Grinding Equipment

[200cfm]

Studied the book some and made my first 30 degree top cut. It's suspose to be 1/32 wide. Hard to see but it is there. Had one stone that was adequate width to stone dress for a 30 angle. Doesn't take much spin to make the cuts either. Just a quick on and off. Then attempted a 60 bowl cut. Had only one stone in the bag that would barely pass through the barrel throat area. Set the stone dresser for 60 degrees and gave it a try. Here is how it turned out. A lot of the bowl is still untouched because there is nothing there.



I made a measurement using the out of round gauge. Couldn't figure out how it worked then finally realized the gizmo floats on the arm that rides along the center of the valve seat cut. And a photo from the book confirmed the setup. I got a runout of .001" And book says .002 or less so I was pleased. Then gave it a valve lap to better see the margins. What would be a good dye to use?

Here is a photo of the stone for the 45 seat. I notice it doesn't get marked the full circumference. Is this coming from the dresser or the pilot or stone bushing?

Finished up by installing the valve with spring and filling the port with fuel to check for leaks. Got some weep. Not much or fast. Very, very slight, but not 100% dry.

[jfholm]

[color=#000000]I used to use a magic marker to mark the seats when I was grinding. Easy and quick to used and cheap. Those new erasable ones for the white boards smell almost just like Dyechem.

I would not get stuck on what the angles "should" be or how wide. That is what the flow bench is for. Most seats from the factory are 45

[49-1183904562]

Tom,

Order some Dykem Blue, From Goodson or Enco it will give you the best Line of site on the seat. Use a piece of welding rod or coat hanger hammer the end thin and grind the width to the seat thickness, use this as a guage to test the seat width, I keep a couple of different ones for Intake and Exhaust.
The seat should not leak fluid at all and it should lap 100% around and conform to the width of the seat, it should lap with a fine compound 280 to 400 grit. Do you take the pilot in and out between stone changes? Next seat use your concentricity gauge to check the rough seat then grind and check again. Are you using Solid pilots or an adjustable one?

Rick

[200cfm]

Pilots are solid. I was removing the pilot to clean, view, and vacumn out the grit. Probley should not be doing that. I think my lap compound is medium grade. Will try and get some fine grade. This is a test experiment cut up head and chamber to see if I can master the technique. The real challenge is trying to use stones for enlargement cuts and valves. What should be the sequence for enlargement. Throat, seat, top cut or seat, top cut, throat? I notice in photos that the throat cut goes up to the very edge of the seat cut. Not sure I can do that with stones. I am starting to see the advantage of Neway cutters here. (tom)

[49-1183904562]

[color=#000000]Tom, with stones I would stick to jut cutting the seat angles 15/30 Top 45/46 seat 53/60 bottom. Say it is a standard 30/45/60 job, you will cut the 45 seat angle then Blue it, once dry you will cut the 30 top angle until you reach your seat OD checking with a pair of dividers or I use dial calipers. Once this is done you will use the 60 bottom cut to get you to your proper seat width I/E .050. Race motors like yours can use a fairly thin seat if they lap good since you will most likely be taking this thing apart often (thinner seats with high spring pressure can beet in and erode at the valve face).

Angles, This is where you as an experimenter will gain the most from the

[bruce]

[Otto]

get yourself some small bottle brush's if you havent already to brush any dust from guide when you do remove and reinsert

[200cfm]

Ok, thanks for all these good points. I am taking notes here. Spent some time on the Goodson site and they have Sioux stones 11/16-16 threads. One size is a blue cool at 1 5/8 with 00 degrees. That size would be about 87% of a 1 7/8 intake valve which happens to be my upgrade test valve size. Could that 1 and 5/8 stone be used to hog out the smaller throat? Then I am thinking a second 1 5/8 stone 45 degree could be dressed for a 60 angle for a bowl taper from the throat down.

When I dress the stones on the dresser should I be adding or using grinding oil?

[49-1183904562]

Tom,

These stones are not meant for allot of material removal just seat cutting and minor blending.

Rick

[200cfm]

I was afraid of that. But I don't have cutters or the machinery to cut away material. I will try what I have on hand here. The Barnhouse book says the stone has to be bigger than the valve seat so if the desired seat is a 45 at 1.875" would a 2" stone be adequate or should I order the 1 7/8 Ruby size stone? tom

[49-1183904562]

Tom, 2" would be great use the finest stone you can get, the grey souix stones are nice i have not tried the blue.

Rick

[200cfm]

Ok, thanks. Just placed an order with Woodward for 6 stones and some red dykem. Their prices were less than Goodson and they had genuine Sioux stones along with PayPal for payment. Hopefully the stone approach will at least let me experiment on a test chamber and port to try different sizes and angles.

[49-1183904562]

I have had a couple emails about the ER Spindle conversion and I have mad little progress with mine as I really do not want to use a wrench every time I change a valve. But al that said I id come across this site lately and if you have an older machine and want to convert to high precision ER collets and variable speed this is a reasonable option. You will only have to create a mounting plate.

Rick

Look at the 65XX series




This will limit you to a 11/32 max valve stem size.

[larrycavan]

Hey Rick,

A buddy of mine picked up a nice Neway machine and finally got it setup. It's the overhead type with the swivel and rolling track.

Anyway I installed new guides in a Kawi head the other day and decided to try his machine out. Much, much, much nicer than dinking around with hand cutters when you need to get some work done.



I did use his cutters for the work though. He's got one nice selection of Neway cutters. He's got some nice ones with 5 carbides. They really do a nice cut on the inside and outside angles.

However, when I got back to my shop, I still ended up using my stones and hand cutters for final touch up. I take the time to get all the stem heights to within .002" so they all take the same shim size.

I have a nice aluminum tool we made that fits down in the tappet bores an holds a dial indicator. Hold the tool in the bore. Install the valve and check the stem heights with the dial indicator. Walk over to the valve machine and grind whatever is needed to even things up.

Yep, it's time consuming but when you're working with old tools, it's just the price you have to pay for making things even...

Larry C



Edited By larrycavan on 1233459017

[msj442]

on the stone dust note i built a bench that i do seats on that has a squirrel cage fan from a furnace in a chamber with furnace filters that when i grind seats it pulls all the dust down and away from me. never had a wiff of it ever since i built this. just thought i would pass that along. been using for about 13 years now